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  #31  
Old 08-16-2015, 02:00 PM
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Default Vacation Game has moved.


Howdy all. My Short Story was moved to Adults Only. Which is okay by me, since I never received one word from many views. Maybe someone there will tell me what they think of the story.

It's an odd feeling to be in Adults Only since I didn't write it tittlilate (sp). I considered it a serious effort where I was trying to get across a justified murder.
Hmm... go figure...

Have a nice writing day.

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Old 08-16-2015, 03:00 PM
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Originally Posted by old guy View Post
Howdy all. My Short Story was moved to Adults Only. Which is okay by me, since I never received one word from many views. Maybe someone there will tell me what they think of the story.



It's an odd feeling to be in Adults Only since I didn't write it tittlilate (sp). I considered it a serious effort where I was trying to get across a justified murder.

Hmm... go figure...



Have a nice writing day.

Hmm... That's weird. I didn't think that story was graphic or exploitative. It had a noir feel to me. I think maybe somebody jumped the gun there.
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  #33  
Old 08-16-2015, 04:06 PM
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Originally Posted by old guy View Post
Howdy all. My Short Story was moved to Adults Only. Which is okay by me, since I never received one word from many views. Maybe someone there will tell me what they think of the story.

It's an odd feeling to be in Adults Only since I didn't write it tittlilate (sp). I considered it a serious effort where I was trying to get across a justified murder.
Hmm... go figure...

Have a nice writing day.
All prose posted on WB is under the scrutiny of the moderation team for replacement if they so desire. I took a look and noticed the reason. There was a rape scene and the story didn't have a disclaimer stating this fact.
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  #34  
Old 08-16-2015, 04:09 PM
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Originally Posted by brianpatrick View Post
Hmm... That's weird. I didn't think that story was graphic or exploitative. It had a noir feel to me. I think maybe somebody jumped the gun there.
The rules BP. The rules! Please read the rules before undermining the intentions of staff.
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  #35  
Old 08-16-2015, 05:16 PM
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Originally Posted by brianpatrick View Post
Hmm... That's weird. I didn't think that story was graphic or exploitative. It had a noir feel to me. I think maybe somebody jumped the gun there.
No -- it wasn't that bad at all. A bra was mentioned, spread legs, a naughty word or two. I've seen titles in Members Only that were more explicit.

Otherwise, just ask the author to add a disclaimer -- at the most, simply remove the story until he has a chance to do it.

Even one of the mods as much as said rape wasn't reason enough to post something in adult content, so moving it there for something that isn't all that sexually explicit or graphic is kind of silly.

Last edited by JoeMatt; 08-17-2015 at 01:36 AM..
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  #36  
Old 08-16-2015, 06:47 PM
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I didn't comment on the story because when I read it I was burned-out. Working a lot. But my impression was that the pacing was off. The action and the homicide happened before I really cared for the characters. Yeah, the bad guy was an ass, and deserved to get whacked, but it felt like a hollow victory.

Since I can't get into the adult section (and really have no desire), maybe OG could disclaim the story, rewrite a bit, and repost it?
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  #37  
Old 08-17-2015, 05:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Bagit View Post
The rules BP. The rules! Please read the rules before undermining the intentions of staff.
This message was deleted because it was an attack on Staff. This edit should be taken as a warning to all.
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Last edited by Mohican; 08-17-2015 at 07:37 PM.. Reason: Attack on a staff member of Writer's Beat
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  #38  
Old 08-17-2015, 06:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Mike C View Post
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This post by brianpatrick has been erased.

Last edited by Mohican; 08-17-2015 at 07:55 PM..
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  #39  
Old 08-17-2015, 10:33 PM
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Default I wrote the offending story: Vacation Game

Hello Everyone.

When it was time to post I couldn't decide where. So I didn't post it but spend time reading the intent of both Adults Only and Members Only. Since I never saw the story in any kind of erotic way, as Adults Only, I posted in Members Only.

As far as I can see, there are two areas of concern with my story. One is the plan to rape and the other is when the killer shows her his erection.

I read the rules for both and couldn't figure it. And the number of those who participate with the Adults Only it quite small, while the Members Only is the largest. The problem is that one person's erarotica is another person's ticket straight to hell.

Here's what I'd suggest. Let management rewrite both rules, but really spell it out. For Members Only I'd suggest a list of 'no no's', such as no reference to rape or an erect penis and other no's as suits them. And for Adults Only, I guess, there would be no rules.

I must say that it made me angry when someone in charge, without contacting me, thought I'd been a very bad writer so the work was moved to where the dirty stories are.

Have a nice writing day.
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  #40  
Old 08-17-2015, 11:03 PM
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I don't understand what the fuss is all about. The purpose of the adult content forum is to add an additional hurdle to keep underage members from reading sexual material, isn't it? So .... why the offended feelings if a story gets moved?
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  #41  
Old 08-17-2015, 11:08 PM
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I posted something similar, but included some snarky comments which made my post invalid. Bad me. It got deleted. I do respect the difficult jobs the mod staff have of keeping everyone happy. In such a diverse crowd, it must be almost impossible. It troubles me that most of the mod team seem to be religious conservatives, and that the inherent bias might cloud their judgement with regard to what is acceptable to the majority, but I accept the deletion of my posts as a necessary offering to the whole of the community.

Fiction writers have always pushed the boundaries. It's in their nature. I am no exception.

I don't see why this can't be talked about in public without people taking it so seriously. I never feel emotional about the subject. To me it's just another thing to be discussed. If I'm wrong, I'll gladly accept the verdict and back down.
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  #42  
Old 08-17-2015, 11:14 PM
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Originally Posted by poirot View Post
I don't understand what the fuss is all about. The purpose of the adult content forum is to add an additional hurdle to keep underage members from reading sexual material, isn't it? So .... why the offended feelings if a story gets moved?

Yes, but why? They can see it no matter what we do. A disclaimer would suffice in my opinion. There is no 'emotion' in what I say. Censoring borderline content without explicit direction is just censorship of art. If we had advertisements here, and had to deal with sponsors, I might agree, but we don't.
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  #43  
Old 08-17-2015, 11:26 PM
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Originally Posted by brianpatrick View Post
Yes, but why? They can see it no matter what we do. A disclaimer would suffice in my opinion. There is no 'emotion' in what I say. Censoring borderline content without explicit direction is just censorship of art. If we had advertisements here, and had to deal with sponsors, I might agree, but we don't.
Oh, you always deny having emotion. Nothing new there. But you are not the only person in this discussion.

If you want a site with no censorship, start your own. The fact of the matter is neither you nor I own this site. Neither of us gets to make the rules. That's life! Get over it!

If those in charge want to have certain rules they get to put them in place. We are visitors in their home, so to speak. If we don't like the rules we are free to go elsewhere. There are some things here that I don't like. So far, though, the good is outweighing the bad. If that changes, I will visit less often. That's the mature way to deal with it. Crying, "That's not fair!" is not.
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  #44  
Old 08-17-2015, 11:41 PM
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Originally Posted by poirot View Post
Oh, you always deny having emotion. Nothing new there. But you are not the only person in this discussion.



If you want a site with no censorship, start your own. The fact of the matter is neither you nor I own this site. Neither of us gets to make the rules. That's life! Get over it!



If those in charge want to have certain rules they get to put them in place. We are visitors in their home, so to speak. If we don't like the rules we are free to go elsewhere. There are some things here that I don't like. So far, though, the good is outweighing the bad. If that changes, I will visit less often. That's the mature way to deal with it. Crying, "That's not fair!" is not.

The rules need to be more specifically written. They are vague, unclear to many. Maybe not to you. I'm certainly not crying. That's your own emotions getting the better of you, I suspect. Hence the (!'s).
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  #45  
Old 08-17-2015, 11:43 PM
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Originally Posted by brianpatrick View Post
If we had advertisements here, and had to deal with sponsors, I might agree, but we don't.
Currently BabiesRUs is the banner ad.
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  #46  
Old 08-17-2015, 11:47 PM
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Originally Posted by poirot View Post
Currently BabiesRUs is the banner ad.

Hmm... I don't have any ads. Are the owners making money with advertisements? If so, I understand the dilemma. I give up.
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  #47  
Old 08-17-2015, 11:56 PM
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Originally Posted by brianpatrick View Post
The rules need to be more specifically written. They are vague, unclear to many. Maybe not to you. I'm certainly not crying. That's your own emotions getting the better of you, I suspect. Hence the (!'s).
I'm not the one who felt it necessary to make multiple posts over a few days on this thread. I'm not the one who posted a story that has already been critiqued on Oddville Cafe after saying that I no longer posted stories for critique here because I had learned all that anyone here was able to teach me that pushes two rules (content and length) that I have been questioning, sometimes to the point of having posts deleted. I'm not the one being emotional.

If the rules are unclear, the mature, logical, unemotional thing to do is to start a thread in this forum and ask for clarification. If you disagree, state your arguments rationally, but drop it when told to drop it.

It's pretty easy to understand that that's what's expected.
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  #48  
Old 08-17-2015, 11:59 PM
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Originally Posted by poirot View Post
I'm not the one who felt it necessary to make multiple posts over a few days on this thread. I'm not the one who posted a story that has already been critiqued on Oddville Cafe after saying that I no longer posted stories for critique here because I had learned all that anyone here was able to teach me that pushes two rules (content and length) that I have been questioning, sometimes to the point of having posts deleted. I'm not the one being emotional.



If the rules are unclear, the mature, logical, unemotional thing to do is to start a thread in this forum and ask for clarification. If you disagree, state your arguments rationally, but drop it when told to drop it.



It's pretty easy to understand that that's what's expected.

I did exactly that. I'm awaiting clarification. Without the the words 'mature' and 'logical.'
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  #49  
Old 08-18-2015, 12:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Bagit View Post
All prose posted on WB is under the scrutiny of the moderation team for replacement if they so desire. I took a look and noticed the reason. There was a rape scene and the story didn't have a disclaimer stating this fact.
Mr. Ed said to look back in the archives for something and sure enough, I found it. A story about statuatory rape posted in Non-fiction which raised no red flags at all.

I think bp may have something with his desire for clarification of what exactly is acceptable and what is not.
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  #50  
Old 08-18-2015, 02:05 AM
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Simply posting a question doesn't result in multiple posts. (Reply to brianpatrick)

And one story, or even more than one, doesn't mean that the rule should be thrown out the window. (Reply to Ed)
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  #51  
Old 08-18-2015, 02:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Mike C View Post
This message was deleted because it was an attack on Staff. This edit should be taken as a warning to all.
Actually it wasn't an attack, just semantics, and clarification of an instruction by staff.

I think Bagit meant to say (and feel free to correct me, I am but a fallible man) is - Read the rules. Do not undermine the staff.

If Bagit can confirm that this was indeed what was meant then I am happy to comply.
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Old 08-18-2015, 04:15 AM
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Originally Posted by brianpatrick View Post
Hmm... I don't have any ads. Are the owners making money with advertisements? If so, I understand the dilemma. I give up.


Whether it's advertisers or the site owner(s), someone is paying for this site and that person or group has the right to set rules that all who visit (members and lurkers) must follow.

Please explain why you think advertisers should get more cooperation or respect than site owners.
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  #53  
Old 08-18-2015, 04:22 AM
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You're never going to get total clarification -- because it's subjective -- like that supreme court justice said about porn, I can't define it, but I know it when I see it. Or something like that.

Otherwise, I posted a story that included a rape scene in Members Only, because it didn't include anything that was sexually explicit or "graphic." I just used by best judgement.

And I've posted several stories in Members Only that included other scenes that are about sex and people having sex -- but again, no mention of Tab A going into slot B using sexually explicit language.

So I don't know -- it doesn't seem that complicated to me. However, if I somehow cross a line, I'd simply appreciate a PM explaining why my story was removed noting that I need to add a disclaimer OR that the story belongs in Adult Content -- then I can decided what I want to do. I really don't need anyone on staff to make that decision for me.

Last edited by JoeMatt; 08-18-2015 at 04:37 AM..
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  #54  
Old 08-18-2015, 04:38 AM
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Howdy.

I became angry because who ever moved my story (Vacation Game) was being 'politically correct', catering to the most sensitive of readers.

I don't write smut. And putting my story in Smut Town was wrong. Especially when the 'rules' are so vague.

I didn't join WB to be a reformer or rabble rouser. I'm here because I enjoy the company of writers and the teacher in me allows me to be helpful to others. And I still believe in the magic of WB feedback for making my work better.

Someone in the leadership group seems to be working an exclusive private agenda . And the idea of being critical of leadership resulting in being automatically deleted borders on dictatorship. In the free marketplace of ideas nothing should get in the way of communicating and all ideas should be welcomed.

I've had my say and, for me, this is over. From now on I'm going to zip my lips about this issue.

I would like to request my story Vacation Game be deleted from WB because I don't want it parked in Adults Only. If someone would do that for me, I would appreciate it.

Have a nice writing day.
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  #55  
Old 08-18-2015, 05:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Prodigalson View Post
Mr. Ed said to look back in the archives for something and sure enough, I found it. A story about statuatory rape posted in Non-fiction which raised no red flags at all.

I think bp may have something with his desire for clarification of what exactly is acceptable and what is not.
Sometimes staff is lenient on issues, Ed... Sometimes something gets missed. Sometimes, especially when a member is new, the rules are enforced so they will learn them.


I don't write smut. And putting my story in Smut Town was wrong. Especially when the 'rules' are so vague.
I don't consider your story anywhere near "smutty". The AC in my opinion is not Smut Town. And if you wish it to be put back in the Members Only forum then put a disclaimer before it and I'll move it back.

If Bagit can confirm that this was indeed what was meant then I am happy to comply.
Your editing skills are not in question here. Other issues, however, are. And yes, that's exactly how it was meant. But to take issue with the statement and further undermine the intention of staff here and in the future is downright immature and not becoming of such a long time member that knows exactly how it was meant.
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Last edited by Bagit; 08-18-2015 at 05:57 AM..
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  #56  
Old 08-18-2015, 07:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Bagit View Post
But to take issue with the statement and further undermine the intention of staff here and in the future is downright immature and not becoming of such a long time member that knows exactly how it was meant.
As I said, my humorous aside (which maybe should have been accompanied by a bunch of smileys?) was not intended to undermine. I was just taking your words literally, as I assumed you meant them.

Thankfully, what with this being a writing forum and all, we can all work together to ensure that what we say is what we actually mean. I would invite you to scrutinise my posts and would welcome your input if ever I lack clarity (as I apparently did with the aforementioned 'humorous aside'). In the meantime I apologise most profusely for any apparent undermining, however accidental it may have been, and will be sure to learn the lesson that I should never question a mod's posts.

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Old 08-20-2015, 01:30 PM
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Originally Posted by JoeMatt View Post
It was that easy for me. Maybe it's changed -- but there's still no way to verify someone's age -- same as when people first join.

Besides, adults only is for explicit content, not "non-PG" content. That can be handled with a disclaimer in Members only, like Tau said.
WRONG!!! I am a screen/fiction writer who as I said in Oh, waiter!, writes with 1950s sensorship laws in mind. However in the 1950s the first season of Perry Mason featured two episodes where a woman was portrayed without any clothing. Camera angles are everything in TV. In writing, scenes that would ordinarily be considered as levity with slight sedual content. (Family Ties and Alex coming out of the shower wearing a towel, because a girl went in comes to mind.) Become rated R due to the fact that saying 'he/she was naked is the same as the same in a book as an unsensored explicit nude shot on television.

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Old 08-20-2015, 05:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Motley Crew View Post
WRONG!!! I am a screen/fiction writer who as I said in Oh, waiter!, writes with 1950s sensorship laws in mind. However in the 1950s the first season of Perry Mason featured two episodes where a woman was portrayed without any clothing. Camera angles are everything in TV. In writing, scenes that would ordinarily be considered as levity with slight sedual content. (Family Ties and Alex coming out of the shower wearing a towel, because a girl went in comes to mind.) Become rated R due to the fact that saying 'he/she was naked is the same as the same in a book as an unsensored explicit nude shot on television.



Andrew Walker.

1950's censorship laws neglect a huge swath of human experience. The beatnik's stabbed a knife into this kind of thinking, and the hippies proceeded to chip at the blocks, but were eventually assimilated into pop culture, lampooned into banality.

I like a lot of PC writing, but the author has to be spectacularly clever.
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