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  #1  
Old 09-25-2017, 02:25 PM
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Default Nothing is new under the sun.


In the mainstream media, we have seen a lot of protesting; and, it has been receiving negative attention. I am not here to discuss my views on an issue. No. I am here to discuss the fact that regardless what the group is protesting about they still have the constitutional right to do so. Thus, let us begin.

In the bill of rights, we have the first amendment, which reads: "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances." I want all of us to pay attention to the last phrase: "the right of the people peaceable to assemble and to petition the government" So what does this imply? First it means that Washington has no right to prohibit that action, for that would violate that group free speech. and second the same group has the right to protest. It also tells us that a group can start a petition against the government. It is that simple.

Now what is not "free speech". Obiviously when you endanger some else right it violates the amendment, and that could mean anything.

What are your thoughts?

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  #2  
Old 09-25-2017, 03:16 PM
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The first amendment is about the government taking action against citizens for exercising free speech etc. That's not happening from what I can see.

There's nothing in the Bill of Rights that protects you from criticism or any repercussions from anyone or anything outside the government.

Some people seem to have trouble making those distinctions.

Last edited by Myers; 09-25-2017 at 03:19 PM..
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  #3  
Old 09-25-2017, 03:53 PM
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However, this site begs to differ: https://www.law.cornell.edu/constitu...irst_amendment
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Old 09-25-2017, 03:59 PM
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If you want to paraphrase or give me something -- anything -- in your own words that might compel me to check out that site, fine -- but you're going to have to do better than posting a link.
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Old 09-25-2017, 04:06 PM
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How about I post a link that backs up what I'm saying?

Oh boy -- we could go on like that all day!
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Old 09-25-2017, 04:10 PM
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In other words, in the lue of the current events: riots are not protected by the 1st amendment but lawful assemblies are. Thus, if someone wants to protest against our government in a peaceful manner, let them be.
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Old 09-25-2017, 04:12 PM
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Uh, yeah.
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Old 09-25-2017, 04:18 PM
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Are you saying you should be immune to criticism or consequences regardless of the position you're taking?

That seems pretty unrealistic.
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Old 09-25-2017, 04:23 PM
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So if you're protesting on behalf of NMBLA or some neo-nazi group, and I'm your employer or you own a business I might patronize, I should be like, oh, that's cool, it was peaceful!
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Old 09-25-2017, 05:20 PM
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If they have permit and are not behaving in a unlawful manner, than yes. Protesting is legit right. However, if it turns into a riot and that exact same group behaves in a unlawful manner, then the local law enforcement should step in.
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Old 09-25-2017, 05:32 PM
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You're missing the point by a mile.

Try to imagine that you own a company and that someone you employ who deals with your customers shows up on Facebook -- a photo of him at a neo-nazi rally, carrying a flag with a swastika on it.

Considering the viability of your business, the feelings of your other employees and most importantly, your customers -- do you give this guy a pass?

Really think about that and get back to me...
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Old 09-25-2017, 05:53 PM
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That is a complicated situation. First, Rallies are a peaceful assembly. Second, it depends on the company policy. But I am sure that no employer would infringe on his right to attend that rally. Nor would I image they would fire him because of that, unless for some reason or another he violate a policy. Thirdly, imagine if it was an Aferica American march in 1960's against racism and prejudice? My point is, no matter how ridiclious the rally is or what the cause is it is protected.
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Old 09-25-2017, 06:06 PM
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The first amendment is solely about repercussions from the government.

In other words, if you exercise what you believe is your right to free speech or assembly etc., and the government tries to fine, jail, or deport you etc. -- that is a violation of your first amendment rights.

As a private citizen, I can criticize you, boycott your business -- or fire you. Perhaps you could challenge me in a civil suit, but it wouldn't be about the first amendment.

If you don't get that, then you have a fundamental misunderstanding of the first amendment.

There's really nothing more I can say -- so good luck.

Last edited by Myers; 09-25-2017 at 08:08 PM..
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Old 09-26-2017, 04:23 PM
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Boycott yes. Judge the other person actions and/or fire them, no. Like I said, unless they have violated company policies, then you as an owner have every right to disciple them, but not if their views differ from yours; that is called discrimination, and that too is also wrong.
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Old 09-26-2017, 04:51 PM
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Not the First Amendment.

"Congress shall make no law..."

There are separate laws that have to do with employment discrimination.
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Old 09-26-2017, 05:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Myers View Post
Not the First Amendment.

"Congress shall make no law..."

There are separate laws that have to do with employment discrimination.

Correct. But if someone wants to peaceful protest in a public arena, and you know them, you should not judge them. If that same person has violated a policy then yes, disciple them. Ask them first not do that. or warn them.
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Old 09-26-2017, 05:27 PM
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How about if the guy is wearing a white sheet?

No judging -- just give him a good talking to?
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Old 09-26-2017, 07:19 PM
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The KKK was an extremely racist group during the civil rights movement, and if there supporters out there, I would probably avoid them...at all cost. Remember, however, someone can not just randomly walk up to your propetry and protest. That is not protected.
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Old 09-26-2017, 08:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Myers View Post
How about if the guy is wearing a white sheet?

No judging -- just give him a good talking to?


If one of my employees was caught on video wearing a KKK outfit or other Nazi bullshit I would fire them immediately.

Not because I don't like the KKK or Nazi's (and I don't), but because my customers would be offended and avoid calling me for work on principle.

For the same reason I don't broadcast that I'm an atheist on social media. Many of my customers are religious and would be offended.

No first amendment rights involved. It's just business.
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Old 09-27-2017, 12:58 AM
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Originally Posted by brianpatrick View Post
If one of my employees was caught on video wearing a KKK outfit or other Nazi bullshit I would fire them immediately.

Not because I don't like the KKK or Nazi's (and I don't), but because my customers would be offended and avoid calling me for work on principle.

For the same reason I don't broadcast that I'm an atheist on social media. Many of my customers are religious and would be offended.

No first amendment rights involved. It's just business.
Of course -- and I'd do the same. I was just kidding.

There was an image of a guy at the recent neo-nazi rally in Charlottesville that went viral -- not surprisingly, that's exactly what happened to him.
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